#LOTRO: New Talent and the Landroval Music Scene

September 13, 2013

LOTRO, Opinions

A lot of stuff has been running through my mind lately about the Landroval music scene. Before I go into what might turn out to be a truly epic rant, I have to toss out a few disclaimers.

  1. I am not calling any one group of people or bands out. Please don’t take this as a personal attack, dually so because I’m not even planning on mentioning any one particular act.
  2. I absolutely WELCOME discussion about this, whether you agree with me or not. I’ve been speaking to people regarding this issue, and I’ve heard multiple opinions from multiple groups. Some agree with me, some don’t. But as long as we’re talking about it, that is a move in a positive direction.
  3. No one particular (or even recent) occurrence sparked this, despite what you may hear from well-meaning (but uninformed) sources. I’ve seen it happen multiple times, and I’ve been thinking about this for a while, and I feel like I finally have a big enough soapbox to say something about it.
  4. To that end, this has absolutely nothing to do with getting me more exposure. I’ve got more than my fair share, y’all. Furthermore, DTMF doesn’t often play even random shows anymore anyway because we are Busy Adults with Many Important Things to Do. I do not WANT and couldn’t really commit to a regularly scheduled show because frankly, I don’t care, and on top of that I’m too dang busy. And so is everyone else in the band. So there you go on that one.

A few of you might have seen my run of tweets from last weekend. For those of you who haven’t, here they are:

And then the sarcastic one:

So this is the gist of it, people. Since I joined Landroval in 2012, I’ve seen a lot of weird things go down in relation to the regularly scheduled shows and events on Landroval. Usually it goes down like this:

Person A decides to do a music or RP event, and announces it somewhere (regional, a private chat channel, wherever). A few minutes later, Person A is informed by multiple parties (let’s say Persons B through F) stating that Some Regular Thing is going on at the time and/or location that they specified, and while Persons B through F don’t always go right out and say "We already have Some Regular Thing happening, you can’t play at that time or venue," that’s typically how it comes across.

Persons B through F are generally (and openly) concerned with how Person A’s event will effect the audience size of the established event. This seems more than a bit ridiculous to me. Landy is a big server, and this is a regular event. Even if the audience is slightly smaller for the Established Event for one week, they’ll likely be back the next week. Why worry about it? Furthermore, shouldn’t the size of your audience depend on the talent of the group, rather than Who Got There First?

This sort of dissenting attitude is potentially scaring new groups and events away. It’s not an approach which makes Landroval at large seem welcoming to new talent. I’ve seen some groups pop up and then leave town in the space of a few days because this sort of things is going on. It is, in short, no good.

There seems to be this expectation now that all events must be scheduled and regimented in some way. This is blocking people from doing their own thing, and (most importantly) being creative. Bottom line is this, guys: LOTRO is a game. Turbine was kind enough to give us a really neat music system to mess with, and an amazing world to play in. We should actively encourage new talent without having to worry about potentially ticking off or stepping on the toes of bands and groups which are already well-established in the community.

Several people have privately approached me since my slew of tweets and told me stories about this sort of thing happening to them. One young man in particular poured his heart out to me, saying that he would really LIKE to join the Landy music scene, but that there are so many "big" groups that it’s simply too daunting and/or intimidating for him to get started. That makes me sad, guys!

Starting a group on Landy seems like the LOTRO equivalent of starting an indie band in Portland. The music scene is so saturated that people don’t feel like they have a chance, and just can’t bring themselves to even try. Granted, this is sort of a different problem, but I still feel like the same logic applies. People will be more likely to start a new group if they feel welcomed, and I think we’ve been doing a really poor job of that.

Others have brought up that many of the prime time slots have already been spoken for, and that’s really the only time they have between work and their personal lives to host an event, or play a music show. How is that fair? Why shouldn’t they have a chance at the Landy big time when it’s convenient for them?

I’m not saying that I’m completely against scheduling events. Having regular events and concerts on Landy is genuinely a major draw of new players to the server. Go ahead and schedule your shows, have your fun, all of that. Just keep an open mind and try not to get upset if someone else wants to have an event at the same time (or even location) that you do. It’s not an attack on you, your group, or your character. They just want a shot at fake music/event stardom too. Be good to one another. That’s all I’m asking.

And again, let’s talk about this! If you think I’m completely off-base, please tell me why! If you agree and things like this have happened to you in the past, share your experiences. I am more than willing and in fact very excited to discuss this in an open, public location where lots of people can actively participate. Let’s chat about this. Let’s fix things, Landy.

*drops the mic*


Chastine Bane-Jones is a Landroval-based musician from Silverlode, which explains her accent. So stop asking about that. She’s a singer, wife, receptionist and graphic artist agent in meatspace, and the leader of the Don’t Tempt Me Frodo kinship (on Landroval and Silverlode) in LotroLand. Additionally, she has been involved in a number of music-related projects in the Landroval RP and music community, and was instrumental in "Rickrolling" Weatherstock two years in a row.

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91 Responses to “#LOTRO: New Talent and the Landroval Music Scene”

  1. Lilrose Says:

    Have you considered starting music events on Brandywine? We used to have them but then some of the players stopped playing a year ago.

    Reply

    • Avatar of Chastine
      Chastine Says:

      This has actually been suggested to me, and I’m giving it some serious thought. My only problem would be the time commitment. Real life has a nasty habit of taking up a lot of my LOTRO time. ;)

      Reply

  2. Floradine Says:

    I can certainly understand why people would tell newcomers to not play at the same time as other bands and I would not expect that those people would really want to stop the new bands.

    Possibly quite the contrary: Maybe the message should be read as “Hey, I can’t be at two events at the same time!”. But that’s just what I think and probably not what new people get told. Knowing you, I’d say you got your impression not completely without a cause… Which is bad, I agree as you know.

    I also agree with the observation that Landroval may be starting to get saturated a bit. It is hard to find a time that is working for the band members and also not colliding with anyone else.

    But never let people stop you if you want to play. If the community needs to learn that things are changing a bit then it -we- should learn it. And continue to welcome every new band that’s emerging. I am very sure that 99% of the music community does that. And the remaining few must learn to live with colliding slots and the effects they have.

    I firmly believe we should establish the rule that no-one should be told to not play music if they want to play music and announces it in the usual channels/blogs/forums/whereever. Actually I though this was a given and I am surprised that it may not.

    We need fresh people. It’s very simple. People take a break from the game or leave it completely. We have seen this some months ago when a well known former Weatherstock band thought about reforming for Weatherstock but ultimately decided to not play. If that happens and no newcomers are coming in -the music community will slowly dwindle.

    So, we should learn to live with overlapping events if they happen. Deal with it, decide who you want to listen to and go there – and don’t tell the other band they should not play. And if you are a band don’t ask any other band to not play during your concert time.

    I have talked about this problem with the other officers of the Lonely Mountain Band and we all agree with this. For us this actually is a natural thing because we actively support music.

    I have an idea how the music community can get itself a bit more organized with spreading news about bands and players who are involved in making music inside and outside the game and can learn to know each other a bit better. More on this in the near future.

    -Flo

    Reply

  3. Avatar of Lilikate Buggins.
    Lilikate Buggins. Says:

    I may not have been on Landy for that long, and I often miss some of the prime time music that happens as most of the EU at that time are asleep.
    I have never seen anyone be told, in any way that they cannot play. I have seen people to consider finding a slot where the established bands are not playing. The slots are somewhat rare for the best times.
    I know if I see a new band I like to stop and ask them about themselves and their music. I will also pass on to my kin mates news of a new band which often brings over other supporters of music.
    I think every one of the larger, more established bands love having new talent appear. We at the LMB encourage it!
    If anyone is told they “can’t” play, then that is impolite, wrong and should be totally ignored. I think what has happened is that we are trying to maximise their audience, if they clash with our event then we can’t go see them unless we cancel ours.
    I also don’t agree with the point that established bands are stale and play the same ole music all the time.
    But it may be true that if an established band was playing in one location and was beaten to the post by another new band, we may be a bit put out. But then three seconds later we would relocate with our audience who do like our music, stale or no and play another location.
    No one owns a spot of LOTRO land, and there is more than enough “spots” to accommodate any who want to play at any time, heck I know that my band, Andune would welcome new talent to share our regular patch…

    Laughter from Mordor will be our only reward if we squabble among ourselves :)

    Lets work together to find a solution to welcome any new folks who want to play. Send me a mail in-game and I will help you with some exposure if you like by writing an article about your new Landroval, or any server band on LOTROPlayers.com

    Reply

  4. Avatar of Goldenstar
    Goldenstar Says:

    Maybe I don’t understand fully how the concerts happen scheduled vs impromptu but as an attendee of concerts I would say my ideal would be for the bands competing for time share a stage. Play in one area and take turns and allow me to enjoy both in one concert location. I dunno if this would be less fun for the musicians though.

    Reply

    • Floradine Says:

      This is a great idea, Goldenstar.

      We (the Andune Ensemble on Landroval) did such a concert just a week ago when the Breakfast Club from Laurelin wanted to play a concert on Landroval. They had it easy of course because both bands share a member who organized it this way.

      I think this would be a great way to promote new bands. Just contact a “resident” one and ask them if you could play right before or right after them and maybe ask if they can introduce you as a new band.

      This also is very easy to handle for the audience then.

      Reply

    • Avatar of Chastine
      Chastine Says:

      Man, I would LOVE to see a two band battle. That would rock!

      Reply

  5. Avatar of
    knowfere Says:

    My thought is when persons B thru F inform person A that there is something already happening, it is out of concern for the newer event, possibly not gaining the attention they deserve because so many people already know about the already happening event….rather than it being “you can’t play at that time/place because you’ll take all the audience”. The music scene on Landroval is indeed going thru a growth spurt. It likely will wax and wane. Musicians and their events are bound to overlap sometimes, but I wouldn’t expect that to be the case forever, and…even if it does, if people enjoy an act, they WILL show up for it. If they don’t, they won’t. And overlap won’t have anything to do with that.

    Reply

  6. Floradine Says:

    I’m going to start a new project for the music community. All servers and not only bound to music, really.

    I’ll call it LotroArtits.

    It’s supposed to be a showcase/interview/informative site for all the creatives out there. And it’s supposed to give us all a good look on the whole creative community that’s a big part of this game.

    I have registered the domain and I am currently looking into setting it up with a nice concept that allows us to bring ourselves to the public.

    More “soon(tm)” here and on Twitter.

    Reply

    • Avatar of Fionnuala
      Fionnuala Says:

      Floradine, that’s pretty much the idea I had when I started the LOTRO Music site here. I’ve put a fair amount of work into it at this point, though not as much as I had hoped so far. I was planning to really dive into it this fall and winter. And while the title says music and it’s very focused on the music system right now, I was planning to broaden it to be more inclusive of all creative players and events. There’s already an event calendar.

      Do you think it’s possible we could work together instead of having two sites for the same thing?

      Reply

      • Keli Says:

        I think it would be great if you could join, Fionnuala. I appreciate what you’ve been trying to do so far. And Lotro has some fantastic, talented writers, artists and musicians.

        Reply

      • Floradine Says:

        Fionnuala, that would be awesome :)

        This is a huge project and it can’t be done by one person alone. I’ll contact you via email to start the discussion.

        Reply

        • Avatar of Fionnuala
          Fionnuala Says:

          Yes, it is and months ago I asked in two places on the LOTRO forums for assistance or contributions for LOTRO Music. A few people have submitted abcs but not one single person ever contacted me about helping with running the site or updating it or writing for it. That’s why it’s been so slow to grow and fulfill its purpose. I’ve got tons of good ideas, but not enough time to work on them. (I’m a mother of 5.)

          Reply

          • Avatar of Fionnuala
            Fionnuala Says:

            I’ve got so much to say on this topic that it would probably make a lengthy article of its own.

            I understand your feeling of frustration with all of the established events on Landy. I have spent a lot of time recently contemplating how I might fit my own projects into the crammed schedule of existing events and feeling quite frustrated myself. I think my own MVT band was (one of?) the first to do regularly scheduled concerts on Landroval. We’d be outside the Pony every Saturday night. GHMS also started playing regularly on their practice nights, EMS moved over the Landy from Elendilmir, two new bands sprang up within LMB that established their own weekly concerts aside from Ales and Tales. It seems as if there are constantly new bands looking for time to play. MVT’s band has long been defunct, but even if I wanted to revive it I don’t know how I would manage to fit it in. There’s also the issue of bands from other servers deciding to set up shop here because our crowds are better. It does feel oversaturated and I sometimes feel there’s no longer a place for me to fit into it.

            One on hand, I understand what you are saying about veterans allowing newcomers space and opportunity. On the other hand, sometimes I feel there is a lack of respect for the veterans among newcomers. Too many people new to the music scene want to start up their own groups rather than joining and bolstering an existing one. This includes bands from other servers who come over for something like Weatherstock and then never want to leave because they’ve never seen attendance so large. They want to wedge their groups into the landscape rather than supporting the existing landscape.

            (For the record, I’m not trying to single you out and I have nothing against you personally, Chastine, but yeah. You too.)

            It can be really hard for existing groups to maintain membership and enthusiasm when new groups are always springing up with new leaders or coming over from other servers. That’s the main reason MVT went defunct. We couldn’t maintain numbers. We’d get great recruits and have fun with them for a while until they’d inevitably join LMB for their numbers. Beorbrand joined MVT once and played with our band a bit and then left for LMB and ended up starting another band. I’ll admit it, I’m still bitter inside. I didn’t want MVT to die. I loved it. But with LMB around, it was ultimately impossible to be a smaller musical kinship. LMB boasts 3 kinship bands and 3 regular weekly music events. There’s just no competing with them.

            Plus there’s the issue of other groups stealing our ideas. MVT hosted the first Wassailing in the Shire event back in 2009. It was our very first event and it was a huge success. While I was organizing the event again for 2010 Bounders of the Shire and GHMS announced their holiday event Wassailing in the Shire. And yes, they knew about the one the year before. GHMS played a song outside of The Ivy Bush during MVT’s event. They didn’t think it was a problem to just take the idea and do their own the next year. They even had the temerity, when I contacted Falibrand about it, to suggest we could still do our own. To continue airing my old resentments, let’s face it, the BBB’s act and projected persona, especially that of Aegthil, were stolen from MVT. Ingolemo had been RPing as the degenerate rock star band leader wearing a color of questionable masculinity (purple) who drinks to much and flirts with all the ladies for a long time before BBB showed up. Then they became known for that act, an act obviously taken from Ingolemo. (Remember, Beorbrand started in MVT and saw Ingolemo’s act first hand and MVT was very well known at the time.)

            Sigh. I didn’t intend to single anyone out when I started writing this, but these things have been bothering me for years. I’m sorry to those people I named above.

            As for the matter of creativity, I’m not sure what I think. I don’t know how much creativity there really is to go around this server. I certainly am bored with the normal concert scene. I’m even bored with Weatherstock. I don’t plan to be there at all next year. I want to do big, ambitious, creative things, but I don’t have enough people to help me do them. I’m well known in certain Landroval circles, but I have very few actual friends and supporters I can rely on. I’m the one everyone waves or bows to because they know my name but nobody talks to at any events.

            I’ve been thinking about my place in the LOTRO music community all summer and I’ve been troubled about it. I’m even more troubled now after reading all this. Especially since all the work I’ve put into something I really wanted to benefit the whole community (my website) may end up wasted. If someone from LMB starts their own site then it will succeed and mine will fail, simple as that. I find this whole subject frustrating. I find myself wishing I could just turn my back on LOTRO and music but I can’t. It’s part of me. I would feel more empty without this outlet for my creativity.

            Call me conflicted about the whole thing.

          • Avatar of Lilikate Buggins.
            Lilikate Buggins. Says:

            Fi you didn’t mention in your rant that you are a member of the Lonely Mountain Band :)

          • Avatar of Chastine
            Chastine Says:

            Fionnuala, I think I mostly understand where you’re coming from, but I’m confused about one thing you said. Why should new (small) bands be expected to just fall in line and join the bigger guys? That statement seemed a little inconsistent with the rest of your post.

          • Avatar of Fionnuala
            Fionnuala Says:

            Chastine, when I was talking about a willingness to join and support existing bands, I wasn’t talking about bands pre existing on another server and moving to Landroval (that’s a separate problem). I was talking about new players who are not a part of any group wanting to form their own groups instead of joining existing ones. I’ve never encountered any musical group who expected their members to just “fall in line”. All the groups I am familiar with are very open to creativity and new ideas from all their members. The only reasons I can see for starting up your own group at this point is if you want something very specific that none of the groups offer or if you simply want control.

          • Avatar of Chastine
            Chastine Says:

            I guess I’m still not quite following you, or maybe this is just a thing we’ll have to disagree on. I don’t personally think that people making their own groups is a bad thing, regardless of the reason. I mean if people want to join the bigger, more established kinships or bands, good for them. But they shouldn’t just be expected to by default just because they don’t have a good enough “reason” to.

          • Avatar of Fionnuala
            Fionnuala Says:

            Well agree or disagree my way of thinking offers a solution to your perceived problems. The difference seems to be that you want the veterans and established groups to change their ways, the ways that created the awesome musical environment that Landroval currently enjoys. I think that the newcomers should try to support the existing ecosystem first.

          • Beorbrand Says:

            To build a successful regular event on any server requires time, effort, consistency, and some unique aspect that people enjoy enough to want to come back week after week. If you’re trying and things aren’t working out, change one of the above items, rinse, and repeat. Be patient, persistent, and open to change.

            I don’t care much for this article’s implications, but I feel I must respond to false comments made regarding the origin of BBB.

            1) I left MVT once it became clear my ideas were not welcome or encouraged there. I wanted to develop a no-holds bar band that would embrace foul humor and different types of arrangements than what was popular within your group. I remain grateful for the knowledge of the music system I gained within MVT, but could have done without the derision regarding my ideas, arrangements, and sense of humor. There needed to be room and support for other types of events besides your own, and from my point of view, there wasn’t. LMB didn’t exactly embrace my concept for BBB at first either, but I had room to make music with other fans of the concept and it slowly grew with time. When I joined LMB, there was Ales & Tales. That was it. BBB came next, and then the Andune Ensemble formed when time zones conflicted with finding a performance time that worked for everyone interested. Now we have three unique and regular open groups that cover most time zones and levels of debauchery, and it’s great. One reason we are able to thrive is that people with differing cultures and views continually find ways to come together in support of making musical events happen even when we all get diva-itis.

            2) Real life always comes first and rightfully so. However, you cannot continuously disappear for weeks/months on end or at a moment’s notice before events and expect undying loyalty and support from your kinship members. From my perspective, that’s why MVT went defunct. It wasn’t LMB coming and recruiting your members away. LMB was the safe musical alternative for me once it became clear that maintaining activity within the kinship was not high on your priority list. There are some people who still happily remain on Landroval in other small musical kinships though they tend to be small and family-based. However, for those interested in casual socializing and regular musical events, then yes, LMB is the place to be on Landroval.

            3) Everything is not your idea, and not about you. Feel free to go back and peruse my original advertisements on Landroval and in the music forums for BBB. It started as three people playing my rotten arrangements of Celtic tunes in front of the fireplace in the Pony while bantering with each other and the dancers a little over two years ago. My job as a music teacher had just been cut and I needed a cheap outlet so I wouldn’t off myself due to depression while I looked for a new gig. We were not nearly as tame (by far) as the standards of anything your group would ever say, do, or perform. We had a blast, we adventured together, and the characters and roleplay-story grew
            from there into what they are now as more people joined the madness. Aegthil remains organic in his lewdness and originally wore black. Please get it straight that my character is the alcoholic and that we both serve as ‘front-men’. Go read the blogs if you want to know the back story. You would certainly know it if you had ever attended any number of our concerts, listened to our original pieces, or watched our ‘moving pictures’. The idea that I recruited some schmuck and shaped him like some mashed-potato man to imitate Ingolemo is hilarious and a real insult to Aegthil’s brilliant Fool, who was brand new to the game at the time. The next time you feel like insulting me, please refrain from using a public forum and just send me a *Mordor* e-mail.

          • Avatar of Fionnuala
            Fionnuala Says:

            Beor, I honestly didn’t mean to insult you. I stated the way I see things. No, obviously I don’t know the whole story but then neither do you. And I’ll admit up front that going into all this in this place was a bad idea. I guess it’s all just been bothering me for so long I couldn’t stop myself.

            Ingolemo and I worked tirelessly for a long time to encourage all of our members with all of their ideas. We were constantly asking for ideas, suggestions and feedback. I recall that you didn’t stick around long enough to see that. I cannot imagine why you think you were derided or discouraged by us. If you felt that way, you certainly never shared your concerns with us. You just disappeared and then reappeared a while later with the BBB. I can tell you now that if you had presented your ideas for the BBB to us we would have been enthusiastic about working them into our regular efforts.

            When you were briefly a member and even when the BBB was started MVT was an active if small kinship. It was having multiple promising members leaving for LMB and a lack of active support within the kinship that caused Ingolemo and I to become discouraged and take some needed breaks from the game. You were long gone by that time so you really don’t have any insight into the matter. For Eru’s sake, we WANTED our members to add their ideas and suggestions to the efforts of the kinship. We always wanted everything we did to be a kinship effort with everyone contributing.

            I’ll try to take you at your word about your band’s act and Aeghtil’s persona but given that we did see many of your early shows and I recall seeing both you and Aegthil in our audience before your shows back before your current act was developed… it’s hard to believe there wasn’t an influence. It’s hard not to see Aeghtil as a knockoff Ingolemo. I probably shouldn’t use that term because you’ll see it as an insult, but it’s really just an honest opinion. I think Ingolemo was better at the whole degenerate act (but I admit that I’m biased) and it’s frustrating to think that if he play his role now people may think he’s ripping off Aeghtil simply because Aegthil has more exposure. (Another one of the reasons he’s been reluctant to be active in the LOTRO music scene lately.)

            I’ve obviously ticked you off quite a bit by this point. The thing is, while this stuff has been bugging me for a while (seeing the BBB springing up and thinking “why didn’t he try to work with us? We’d have loved to do this kind of concert as a kinship effort. We love Celtic music.”) I do not dislike you or have anything against you as a person and a player. I respect the work you’ve put into the BBB. I respect you and Aegthil as musicians and community members. I’m just trying to be as objectively honest as I can.

          • Aegthil of Gondor Says:

            Well, well. A public accusation of plagiarism. How unpleasant.

            The flamboyant, badly-behaved musician, dressed in outrageous clothing, is a stereotype. It’s a caricature. Ingolemo copied the idea from real life. So did I. In fact, I caricatured it from my OWN real life.

            To suggest that I stole Ingolemo’s idea is, quite frankly, delusions of grandeur. It really doesn’t pay to overestimate your own importance.

            But you’re right about Beorbrand controlling Aegthil’s actions. You should see what the puppet-master makes Aegthil do off-camera. Really, you don’t want to know. It’s nasty.

            Aegthil’s Fool

          • Avatar of Fionnuala
            Fionnuala Says:

            Fine. I’ve seriously put my foot in it (perhaps both feet up to the ankles, one could say). I’m sincerely sorry for my accusation of plagiarism. I don’t think that’s precisely what I meant, but it certainly is what I said. I was insensitive and wrong and you both are perfectly justified in your anger. Again, I’m sorry.

  7. Floradine Says:

    LOL, LotroArtists of course. *headsmack*

    Reply

    • Avatar of Vræden
      Vræden Says:

      I was going to ask you about that, because I first read it as LOTRO-are-tits, and I don’t think that’s what you meant. But if that is what you meant, I support you 100% percent. Interpret that any way you want.

      Reply

  8. susan Says:

    I made a toon on landroval to partake of these festivals and events. I enjoyed them immensely but started to notice a definite clique-i-ness to it all. As a newcomer I felt that my char was there to just be filler to the landscape for the regulars.

    In the end it became obvious to me that the concerts were just vanity affairs for a set group of friends and that my polite participation wasnt really important or wanted. Any polite interactions, emotes or RP with the cliques were ignored.

    I know .. I know… im sure its not intended that way, just my experiences and others. we quit going in the end.

    Reply

    • Avatar of Lilikate Buggins.
      Lilikate Buggins. Says:

      Hi Susan,

      I came to Landroval in late december last year too, yes I was new, I felt like I was on the outside.
      But the music was great! As I got to know people they responded warmly to me.
      If you emote at someone you can’t always expect them to see it, or respond. Big bands can be busy trying to arrange who’s playing what instrument, or what they are going to do now someone has gone link dead.
      For all those who arrive at Andune to dance and have fun, I thank you. We do love seeing you all. I would not snub anyone who emoted at me, but I may miss spotting the emote!
      After a while of seeing my face, and I must admit I did make a point of actively making friends to those characters I felt I liked the most. I am now known about town and more people wave to me as I pass by.

      Reply

    • Avatar of Chastine
      Chastine Says:

      It can be a lot of hard work, Susan. I remember when I joined Landroval, people didn’t really respond to me at first, either. Unfortunately it can be sort of exclusionary at first- a lot of people have their old friends and acquaintances and aren’t as on board with chatting with a ‘newbie’ at first. It kind of reminds me of the first few weeks at a new school. You have to let the other kids kinda feel you out before you’re ultimately accepted.

      Reply

    • Sonca Says:

      Susan,
      I had a similar reaction when I first came over to Landroval just over a year ago. In my case, my RL social anxiety did not help the situation. However, I kept going to the various events and lightly poked in to the ongoing light RP that was happening; laugh at the jokes, share a pie, etc. As both Lilikate and Chastine have already mentioned there is a lot going on and the new people may easily get overlooked at first (not that it is right, just that it does happen). This may be due in part to the large number of people who seem to show up for one or two events and then are never seen again. As a result some people may not want to expend the effort until it seems like you are not going to just wander off. I know it takes me interacting with someone over several events before I start to remember them.

      As for me, these last few months when I am at an event in the audience I tend to go AFK quite a bit so I miss out on a lot of the banter. I may not see someone’s comment or emote to me until long after it has happened. When I am in the band I miss even more since I am concentrating on the fellowship chat used to keep the show going (unless I see Pie being mentioned, then I am all over that!)

      So keep coming out to any of the regular concerts and events if you are still interested and have not been burned too bad. Yes, there are some cliques, but I do not believe it will ever be possible to be in a social environment that you did not find any. Unfortunately, it is a part of human nature. It takes some time but you will find we really are a friendly bunch (especially if you have pie).

      Reply

  9. Avatar of Diamond
    Diamond Says:

    I think I may have had some exactly opposite experiences on Landy: one time I was attending a music event on a little-used alt. No one knew it was me. During the event another player began chatting via /tell in character. I was a bit flummoxed because I’m not really an adept role-player, but I thought it was refreshing to have someone reach out to a stranger like that.

    As a band leader/player, I know that I seldom am able to keep up with what people are doing in emote or say channel because I’m getting queued up, directing the group, announcing a song, or trying to figure out who will take the part of someone who just went link-dead. Even /tells have to be ignored until I have time to read them. And I am notoriously bad at multi-tasking as well! lol!

    EMS encourages others to play both before and after the concert, we deal with the after-concert as part of the event, keeping things running smoothly as possible. Recently we have seen a marked increase in whole groups sharing songs in turn during this time, including members of an Aussie group (The Whole Bard band) who are available at that time (our evening being their midday following!), one of which is a regular member of EMS. It has really been fun. There is often an hour or more of this “after-show” music. The only music playing that gets discouraged is the occasional griefer or new player who doesn’t understand that it is rude to play music over the top of someone else (whether the band or an Open Stage participant).

    It’s true that often the same people who we see in our audience are the same people who are there for most the other ones! But, there are still quite a few other players who love to listen and participate, enough for more than one group to play in any given time slot. So far, at least, we have not had anyone decide to set up a concert in the same spot at the same time as us. But, just in Michel Delving alone there are several really good locations to hold a concert, so I don’t see it being a problem.

    Reply

  10. Avatar of Fionnuala
    Fionnuala Says:

    Oops, my huge rant above wasn’t meant to be in reply to Floradine’s comment. It was just supposed to be a general comment.

    Lilikate- Actually I am sorry to inform you that I am no longer a member of LMB. The truth is that over the summer I finally decided that I would try out LMB to see if it was as great as all that. To see if, as a musical person, it would end up being good for me after all. I’ve struggled to find my place since MVT went defunct. And LMB being what they are, I just had to try. But while all the people in LMB are good people and LMB has been a tremendous boon for the community of LOTRO, I ended up deciding that it wasn’t the right place for me. Nothing against LMB, it just isn’t the right fit. I don’t feel like I belong there.

    Reply

    • Floradine Says:

      No worries, Fionnuala, a mother of five children (wow!) can have a free rant anytime in my book. If I understand you correctly I think what you need could be someone who takes on the technical part of the whole project and do the organizational stuff so you can focus on content and ideas. Am I on the right track? If so, I will contact you tomorrow after some more thinking and then we continue behind the curtains, ok?

      Reply

      • Avatar of Fionnuala
        Fionnuala Says:

        I would definitely love to talk to you in depth about this. It’s not that I mind the organizational stuff, it’s just that if I want to grow the site there’s going to be too much to do for me to handle. So I’d love anyone who can contribute to any part of the site’s purpose to assist.

        Reply

        • Harper Says:

          We were happy to have you, and wish you well on your journeys, Fionnuala. I’ve always admired the work that you’ve done in LOTRO and I was honored that you’d give LMB a chance. We are all in the same community and all looking to enjoy our time in Middle Earth. Let’s focus on those things we do agree on: Music, fellowship, and creativity. Keep those in the center and the rest will fall in soon enough.

          –Harper

          Reply

    • Avatar of Lilikate Buggins.
      Lilikate Buggins. Says:

      Oh well! Swings and roundabouts… I wish you joy in your next kinship!

      Reply

  11. Avatar of Mysteri
    Mysteri Says:

    As events director of Lotro Players (www.lotroplayers.mymiddleearth.com) I am fully aware how difficult it is to schedule events on any server, not just Landroval, without it conflicting with some other event on the same server or some other server. Music is a big part of any event and it is hard to get ppl to commit due to other bookings.
    Landroval’s popularity is largely due to the Weatherstock event that LMB manage to pull off every year, bigger and better than the year before. Yeah, bands do want to stick around on Landroval and play, because they also need to grow a fan base there as well.
    I am relatively new to the music system in LOTRO and I swear I will be bald by the time I figure out how to turn a midi file to an abc file as I am sitting frustrated, tearing my hair out trying to figure it out. But when I have been anywhere, just practicing a new song, I have had ppl come up and talk to me about the song I am playing etc. People want to hear music played. Whether it is a “known” band or an obscure individual such as myself.
    I think the events such as LMB’s “Ales and Tales” is a great weekly event where anyone, known or unknown can play their music and feel like they are in a “safe” environment. I also don’t believe ppl would be told not to play as an attempt to get them to leave a server or make them feel “small” in anyway. No one I have encountered on Landroval has done that to me and I feel, like others have posted, that if they have mentioned another band playing at the same time, it is merely to point out that if the newbies don’t get the numbers, not to be disheartened.
    It is hard to find an original idea for events etc as there are so many to compete with and all, in some way, shape or form, will have elements the same as others. But in saying that, does it really matter who comes up with an idea, are we not all working as a “team” when it comes to event organising?
    Isn’t the aim of all these concerts and other Player driven events all the same? Are we not doing it because we love the game and want to make it as enjoyable for others as it is for us?

    Have fun

    Reply

  12. Avatar of Hoppa
    Hoppa Says:

    Hullo!
    Just thought I’d say,
    My band is a smaller Band on Landroval. We set a time 6 years ago and a date, and decided we’d play randomly through out the Shire.
    If folks wanted to find us they asked in Regional ( or other chat channels )
    We rarely have more than 4 band members on any night, usually just three of us.
    I never worried if we didn’t get some special exposure.
    Our plan is to have fun, and some times we draw a big crowd some times we have one or none.

    Landroval has some amazing bands, the size of the band does not chance the talent skills and effort gone into composing songs.

    I’ve even specifically tried to include bands that felt they were nto getting enough exposure by introducing them to other bands and our Landroval music crowd in hopes they could do a few opening pieces because that does help become known on the server.

    As for bands becoming ‘stale’ I don’t believe thats a true factor.

    Every band has old favourites people want to hear and expect to hear.
    But these same old established bands has songs they create and re-create new every week.
    While I may be a minority in band size, since we are very small, our band has 6 years ( over 800 ) worth of songs we work from.

    This should not mean we are stale, as we have a lot to work with ( and many we are re-doing hehe as they can be improved on )
    This also does not diminish any new bands songs at all.
    Even if the new band creates the same songs an older band has, the song probably will be different. Different timing different keys different rythm, and so on… So there in my opinon is room for us all.

    While its true some small bands do “trade members” back and forth between bigger bands that should not reflect any difference on the small band or the big band but on Landroval as a whole, we are a big family, we know each other by reputation and by kinship and friendship.
    Landroval has open arms to any and every band, you just need to talk to people!
    :)
    I have played a lot of games, there are rude people… everywhere but in Landroval in Lord of the Rings Online.

    SO yes, plenty of room for us all :)

    Just talk to folks they will help you. Help you estabish your band, and more!

    Reply

  13. Lasswen Says:

    Living in Australia my regular game time means I don’t usually get to see a lot of the music scene on Landy. Although I take part when I can (as Diamond mentioned, some of the No whole Bard members play during the EMS open stage, as well as with EMS during the preceding concert) I have to say that I haven’t come across any such instance as Chastine has described, and in fact have found some particularly supportive folk in our audience. I don’t know if it makes any difference that the two that come to mind aren’t actually Landroval natives.

    As to schedules, we knew weekly concerts of mostly fresh material was beyond us given commitments elsewhere, and so we monthly concerts with testing in between times.

    I consider that bands are born for varying reasons and some folk play with more than one band for varying reasons. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that.

    Without knowing details of anything that may have happened previously, perhaps new bands might not know when the established bands play. Not everyone may keep up with the LOTRO forums, or other sites, to find out who is playing where. If there ends up being some sort of ‘gig guide’ of who plays where for each server it might need more than posting on the forums. It would be great though if that sort of thing came to pass, because anyone who found they had a spare hour or so that they could spend in game, and was in the mood for music, would have a ready reference of what might be on at that time.

    Surely there is enough love of music to allow everyone their time and space to play.

    Reply

  14. Avatar of Lilikate Buggins.
    Lilikate Buggins. Says:

    I was wondering how many new bands were out there? Would your new band like some exposure? I have an idea for an event to promote new creative talent in a one off event in December.

    You can find me on Landroval, usually playing on a Sunday with Andune (LMB), sometimes I let my hair down and turn into WONDERLILI and play with the BBB.
    Which I have experienced as a fantastic, warm, welcoming and fun kinship. With some very talented musicians who compose, transcribe and arrange for all our bands, and for other bands and musicians also.

    So send an in-game mail to Lilikate and let me know all about your band and yourselves. Or you can leave me a private message on the Middle-Earth Network.

    I do believe it’s time for action and less whinging!

    Reply

  15. Mirinaeth Says:

    I personally think this post was a fantastic idea. It may have provoked some angst-ridden conversation, but I think “provoking conversation” was the point in the first place. There have been a lot of good points made from both the article itself and the comments. I figured I’d just add my two cents to the bunch. I feel like if people want to have established concerts, it should be fine, and people should be respectful of those times. However, that said, I also think that established groups shouldn’t take offense if a newcomer to the scene plans something at the same time. It isn’t a blatant sign of disrespect; it is simply a group that wants to play who may have no other time to do it, based on RL and the potential for people to be entertained. That is the point after all, if I’m not mistaken, to entertain others while having fun yourself. I think both the established band and the newer groups have to keep a few things in mind in the case of show overlap: The established group *have* put in a lot of time and effort to get the following they have. The newer group wants to entertain people and knows that people have to come of their own choosing if another event is going on at the same time. This leads me to the audience’s role in this. Every person has the right to choose what they want to do at a given time in-game; however, I believe it is our responsibility as a welcoming and supportive community to at least go see the new people perform if it means taking 10-15 minutes away from a show you see every week. Just give them a chance, that’s all they want. As far as it being hopeless for new people, I think Chastine and I and our bands are perfect examples of how that isn’t necessarily the case. Chastine was how I got into music in Lotro in the first place, and we did a lot of cool things together. We did make the transition to Landroval for Weatherstock and I did end up staying for good. Even though Chastine and I are doing our own things now, she still has Don’t Tempt Me Frodo, which has a fantastic following and lots of awesome gigs with other Landroval creative projects. My group, Flock of Smeagols is steadily gaining a following through shows, our blog (Landroval Lampoon’s Guide to Lotro), the Trapdoor Tavern, and Ales & Tales performances. So to the veterans: We love and respect you, and wouldn’t have the opportunities we do without you. You are fantastic entertainers and provide people with a great way to have fun and enjoy the lighter side of Lotro. To the audience: Thank you for your loyalty to the established groups and thank you for keeping an open mind about new groups in the scene – they appreciate every moment you give them! To the hopeful performers: Don’t be afraid to get out there. Don’t be afraid to “step on people’s toes”. If you want to play, play. Keep trying; don’t give up. Support each other. Have fun with it! Thanks for the post, Chastine, and thanks everyone for the discussion!

    Reply

  16. Tuiliel Says:

    This kind of drama is why I withdrew from Landroval events. Too much focus on maintaining the images of ‘celebrities’ and not enough on the enjoyment of the game and its creative opportunities. From what I’ve seen at concerts lately, the conversation is 99% made up of cliche racial jokes (yes, we know hobbits like pie–is there nothing else we can talk about?) and pretend girlfriends/boyfriends slobbering on each other. Even as an LMB member, I’ve honestly never had anyone at a Landroval event talk to me, except for the people designated to trade pipeweed/ale, and a few new kinnies at my first A&T three years ago.

    I’d love to see more new groups playing music I haven’t heard before, and real interactions that allow characters to be more than cartoons. I’d also like to see an atmosphere that allows for the fact that this is a video game, and people come here to enjoy themselves when they have the time and shouldn’t be locked into other people’s schedules when they want to do something. But I’m not terribly optimistic, and even less so after seeing this thread. When I was on Nimrodel, our teeny tiny RP community had no well-known RP kins and no regular server events, just people who would get a spark to do something and go for it. It wasn’t choreographed with perfectly synchronized dances. It didn’t require registration ahead of time. It was just fun people getting together to do fun things and opening up creative possibilities. Too bad we don’t do that anymore.

    Reply

  17. Tuiliel Says:

    Wow, after seeing the massive drama on the LMB web site as a result of this article and all the nastiness caused by a simple request to look at the possibility of letting new folks on the scene, I’m out of here. Happy hunting everyone.

    Reply

  18. Floradine Says:

    What I really am very sad to see is that someone started ranting and trying to belittling others and then after someone else tries to defend herself jumps on exactly that with laughter. To see that was very disappointing and real eye-opener for me.

    Also the way said rant was concluded was more or less brute force. If people would turn away now, it implied, they are the bad guys, the losers.

    There is a word for such a behavior on the internet but I will not utter it here.

    I don’t think this is the culture many people want to live in. And personally I am not available for such treatment.

    If you want to be my friend you will have to be nice. I am quite sure that many here would say the same of themselves. And if you have a problem you can talk to me anytime. You may have seen that I am more than willing to help and solve the problem. I am already doing a whole lot that is constructive to solve the problem of newcomers to find themselves around in the music scene of this game. I have already invested money and a buttload of time to get this problem solved as good as possible.

    The other thing that happened is that now former friendships are in danger as a result of trying to stir up people. This is very very bad in my personal opinion. I hope those people will wake up soon enough to see that some things are too old and too important to easily let go of them. Don’t let friendships slip just because of a weak moment.

    I think we should get back on topic again. From what I have read here the gist of it is:

    Want to play? Then play.
    Want us to plug you? Just ask us and we will introduce you to the audience.
    Don’t want that? I am sure you will know what to do then.

    Go and grab your lutes and strum away in the game. I’ll see you there.

    Reply

  19. Avatar of Chastine
    Chastine Says:

    I have to say that I was not at all prepared for the backlash this article got. My intention wasn’t just to ‘stir people up,’ it was to get people talking about what is (obviously) a very touchy subject. And in my opinion, it doesn’t need to be, especially when the overarching message was ‘Hey guys, let’s be nice.’

    There have been a ton of great suggestions, some very thoughtful commentary, and overall I feel like (at least among the comments on this post, and not counting the unpleasantness)this was pretty positive. That said, I also have access to the LMB forums, and some pretty hurtful stuff was said about me. There were several things implied that simply aren’t true, and I feel like either a lot of things I said were either very much taken out of context, or that there was subtext inserted that was simply not present in my article.

    If you don’t agree with me, that’s fine. I don’t regret what was stated in my article, but I am mildly shocked at the reactions some parties had because of it. I don’t appreciate that friendships and business partnerships are now in question because I said something that some other folks didn’t like. That’s not fair, and is verging on emotional blackmail, which is not at all cool. I will say again, my intention was not in any way to upset people. This was meant to be a public conversation, which is why I brought it to CSTM.

    Reply

    • Floradine Says:

      Chastine, we all are aware that you aren’t at all responsible for any friendships to been tested a bit. That paragraph was not meant at you, please worry not about that. Please let us talk. But not here. I’ll shoot you a mail.

      Reply

    • Avatar of Lilikate Buggins.
      Lilikate Buggins. Says:

      I began a thread on my Kins Forums to address your issue. I asked three questions.

      1. Did you have a point, is there an issue that needs addressing?
      2. Can the LMB do more to help new bands?
      3. Is the LMB stale and do our bands need to bog off and clear the way for new folks?

      I was not nasty, I was very respectful. I had ideas and opinions with I voiced in a calm manner.

      I made comment that action and not whinging was needed.

      I had a new idea.

      I invited you to help me, I asked you to tell new bands you encountered who had an issue to email me, I asked you to send me their details so I could find them. I am very happy to welcome any new talent that needs a helping hand.

      No your response was to say your far too busy with real life.

      I thought you had a valid point, New talent can feel isolated and bullied. Being new to Landroval can be a daunting experience.

      We at the Lonely Mountain Band, could make sure we welcome new talent and be careful in the way we say things or present information so that it does not upset or inflame other people.

      I do not think our weekly events should change. I feel we have new people join, new composers write. Our bands may have favourite songs but we also develop in an organic way over the times. Making our events one of the most popular on our server and drawing a good crowd on a weekly basis. Ales and Tales last night had a very healthy crowd, and Beux Chapeux played after we were finished. I know I stayed and supported them :)

      So how about finding me those folks that need a bit of exposure so I can help them, it dosn’t take longer than your next post :)

      Reply

      • Avatar of Chastine
        Chastine Says:

        The issue is that you are not ‘inviting’ me so much as demanding that I help, Lily. I don’t enjoy being harassed (asking me multiple times does count as harassment at this point, especially when I have refused you each time), and I truly don’t have the time to spend to help you with this project. It’s a great idea, and as I said on the LMB forums, it’s very good of you to start it, but I simply don’t have time.

        Floradine, I’ve already answered your email. Unfortunately your idea of ‘talking’ is expecting me to do exactly as you say and keep my mouth shut anywhere but in private. I understand that this post has not made me popular, but that’s MY problem.

        Reply

        • Avatar of
          knowfere Says:

          This is just an observation as I do not know you Chastine, but, my view from the sidelines of the majority of this topic is that you started a post indicating that yourself and others were having a problem with the well known Landy musicians and bands because of exposure, popularity, /tells about time and venue clashes ect. It has been said by many of the well known acts that it take time, a long time in some cases, patience and inventiveness. Yet, in your original post you mention something about it all being akin to “starting an indie event in Portland”. I ask, how could it be any different than such? You have mentioned several times that you do not have the time for this or that, so I ask What do you expect/want? Instant popularity? That just will never happen..and I don’t think any act that is well known experienced instant success and popularity. Lilikate asks you to point her in the direction of the bands you stated were having the same thoughts as yourself, yet, I think I’ve read one person in response to this who sounded like they had tried and were frustrated like yourself and you have not provided names..(which may be yours or their choice and that is fine, but if you’d like the exposure you seek, you gotta be willing to get info out there, connect with people, ect)
          Just my observations

          Reply

          • Avatar of Chastine
            Chastine Says:

            I said in the article this is not about getting me any more exposure. I feel like I’ve got my fair share already because I’ve worked the scene personally. I have done my time, and worked pretty hard for it. I’ve worked with the LMB and BBB with real life music projects. I’m pretty outgoing, so this wasn’t much of a problem for me. Some people are not, and that’s who I was speaking up for. I can’t help the fact that I’m pretty busy in real life. In fact, I barely have time to play lotro anymore, much less put aside time to organize concerts or music projects. I’m not sure why I’m being vilified for this.

        • Avatar of Lilikate Buggins.
          Lilikate Buggins. Says:

          I am sorry that you feel I was demanding any thing from you Chastine. From your posts I had assumed you had experience of meeting new bands who were struggling to break into the Landroval music scene.

          I was only requesting the details of these bands so that I could contact them and begin a dialogue, toward getting them some exposure, or having them join a set with an LMB band. We have a big crowd some days and we are happy to introduce our audience to new talent.

          I am sorry to have made you feel in any way pressured :(

          Reply

  20. Avatar of Fionnuala
    Fionnuala Says:

    Well, Chastine, I can personally attest that even when you start out with the best of intentions everything can go horribly wrong.

    The other day I allowed a moment of weakness to lead me to make a very bad choice, the choice to air my personal frustrations in a public forum. One on hand, this was a stupid, stupid thing to do and I said some stupid, stupid things.

    On the other hand, it’s allowed me to finally come to terms with all of the things I complained about in a way I never had before. It’s allowed me to see how badly I was coloring my perceptions with personal biases and lingering nostalgia. Some times you need to let the stupid things come out of your mouth (or fingers?) before you can realize how stupid they’ve been all along in your head.

    I think I can finally put all that unjustified frustration and bitterness behind me. I think I can finally move forward. I’m sorry that I insulted people to get to this point. Indeed, I’m ashamed because I’ve always been a great advocate for giving people the benefit of the doubt and in these areas I’ve really been a hypocrite. I never gave Aegthil or Beorbrand the benefit of the doubt when I should have. I hope I’ve learned my lesson. And I hope the things I’ve said here haven’t caused an unhealable rift between myself and anyone whom I’ve insulted.

    Floradine, I hope my mistake hasn’t made you reluctant to work with me. Your site looks amazing and I’d love to be a part of it.

    Reply

    • Aegthil of Gondor Says:

      Not a rift at all, Fionnuala. I had a moment of irritation, but it passed quickly. I have enormous respect for all the musical stuff you’ve done in Lotro, and that endures. I really wouldn’t worry about your comments. We’ve all been there, me more than most.

      Of course, Aegthil will remain annoying, and probably rude as well! But rest assured that I’m standing behind Aegthil, and have every intention of remaining your friend and colleague. Although it might not always be obvious from Aegthil’s behaviour :-)

      Aegthil’s Fool

      Reply

    • Floradine Says:

      I’ll contact you soon, as promised. Right now I am busy with preparing a trip and stuff. Please allow for some days until I have returned.

      I am glad that old roots go deep enough to withstand the frost.

      Reply

    • Keli Says:

      Fionnuala, those are wonderful words and I respect you utterly for being brave enough to say them.

      Reply

  21. Kiralynn Says:

    There are people who think that no one should be upset if two events are scheduled at the same time. There are those who think that it’s disrespectful and/or mean to schedule over an event that someone worked very hard to arrange and promote.

    I don’t believe that either group is going to convince all the members of the other point of view to join their “side”. I really believe the only solution is for both groups to respect the other’s point of view. Compromise is essential in this situation.

    I also think that it isn’t fair to talk about over-scheduling events as if all events are the same. There are important factors to consider. Setting up a band and playing during a horse race is different than doing so during the Fellowship Walk, for example. Music and horse racing attract players with different interests. The Fellowship Walk only happens once a year and addresses a very important topic (fundraising for sick children).

    Just a little bit of respect and politeness would go a long way.

    Perhaps we could agree that:

    * Event hosts should make some effort not to schedule over other events that have published their time and date in advance in the LOTRO forums, CSTM, or other high-traffic sites.

    * If an event host simply isn’t free at another time, they will at least plan to hold their event in a location that doesn’t share the same Regional channel, in order to minimize spam and the appearance of event competition.

    * If an event host finds out that he has scheduled over a major event (IE: Fellowship Walk, Weatherstock, etc.) he will seriously consider moving his more casual event to another time or day.

    * Annual (1/year) events may be scheduled over regularly weekly events. This shouldn’t be alarming. The weekly events will have plenty of other opportunities to do their thing.

    * If two events end up taking place at the same time, despite an effort to be polite, both event hosts should simply get on with their event, being tolerant of each other. Players will be disappointed that they cannot attend both at the same time, but sometimes that just can’t be avoided.

    Basically, a “new” band would be polite by attempting to schedule in a way that doesn’t overlap, if they are able to do so. If they cannot, we’ll all cope. If time must overlap, location doesn’t need to. “New” bands will benefit from this, too, as there will always be another band coming along after them.

    I’m sure we can find a balance between respect and freedom.

    Reply

  22. Floradine Says:

    http://lotroartists.com/calendar/

    Here is a calendar for that, it’s already functional. For the time being send me your event dates via email and I will put them up as quick as I can.

    Please send to LotroArtists@gmail.com

    Reply

    • Floradine Says:

      Please add a description of the event too and if you have a picture for it that would be even greater :)

      Reply

    • Ghingeriel Says:

      Thanks for the calendar link, Floradine. Hobbiton Philharmonic has been trying to plan a date for months and we never seem to find a time when a band isn’t already playing. Our little impromptu style from many years ago doesn’t suit the current Landroval scene but we still have music to play and abc files older than elves! ;-)

      Reply

      • Bluebonnett Says:

        Lady Gingerale! Don’t let the current music scene impact the Hobbiton Philharmonic’s plans for performing; I know there are several of us that would be thrilled to watch y’all play. :)

        Reply

        • Ghingeriel Says:

          Oh my stars, you all are the best! We would never ask a band to stand aside but performing afterward would be …well, beans AND bacon (which hobbits love)! ;-) And we’ll be the beans, especially if Eurmal is playing.

          We love the musical community here and we have always believed in a noncompetitive, supportive environment. It’s so touching to know that Hobbiton Philharmonic hasn’t been forgotten. <3

          Reply

      • Avatar of Diamond
        Diamond Says:

        More than a few would be glad to have HP perform again! In fact, I’ll bet beans to bacon that if you asked any of the regularly-scheduled bands they’d happily step aside for one night to let you and HP take the stage! All it takes is a few inquiries to band leaders to set up a date :D

        Reply

      • Avatar of
        knowfere Says:

        I still have “Fall” in my favourites folder :)

        Reply

      • Avatar of Lilikate Buggins.
        Lilikate Buggins. Says:

        I would love to see you perform!

        Reply

      • Floradine Says:

        Just tell me when you are going to play the next time and I’ll put you onto the calendar. We also should do an interview to get you some exposure on the site.

        Reply

  23. Ghingeriel Says:

    Oops, I’m thread-challenged! See my reply a few boxes up. :-P

    Reply

  24. Avatar of Harperella
    Harperella Says:

    The Hobbiton Philharmonic is what got me interested in LOTRO music many long years ago when Harperella was a level 8 minstrel. There in Coomb, were a troupe of performers dancing barefoot in the town square. The music was sublime, and drew me into Middle Earth.
    There is room enough for everyone, old and new in Landroval. Respect your elders and welcome the newcomers, and never be afraid to try something new. This community is dynamic and vibrant, not a stale band of fuddy duddys keeping out the upstarts. The only thing keeping new bands back is themselves. If the established bands weren’t there there would be no audiences to be had-just random passers by at the Auction hall. Whether there are established bands or not, it will always be hard work and consistent performance that earns you a following. Having a vibrant music scene opens more doors than it closes. So rejoice that you are here at this place at this time. Years from now it will all change and we’ll wistfully remember how great the music scene was back on Landroval in 2013. Just as I still cherish memories of a musical cohort dancing shoeless in Coomb. Who will you enchant, when next you visit Middle Earth? We’re all enchanted by this Fae world of elves and hobbits, music and dance. Celebrate and join in the party! That’s what makes LOTRO a very special place.

    Reply

  25. Avatar of
    knowfere Says:

    I’m not seeing a reply button after the back n forth I had going with Chastine above so I’m stating my final thoughts here. Chastine, I wasn’t vilifying you for anything, but you are the one who started this discussion, I”m assuming to be a champion for the underdog, which I admire. But, I’m not seeing any underdogs coming forth. Which leads me to think there is no problem here. You said this wasn’t about you, ok. So, then why are there so many still here hashing out a non existent issue?

    Reply

    • Cesela Says:

      Ok. Stop.

      Yes, she started the discussion. But, in reality, you all are treating her like an underdog. It is stated in the article above that she is the band leader of Don’t Tempt Me Frodo. Very far from an underdog in my opinion. Hence why no underdogs/small guys are coming forth on the issue.

      You guys are doing EXACTLY what happens on the server. You are the ones belittling and bullying the one willing to stand up for and put out there that this is a problem (whether or you guys admit it or not). In real life, all it takes is one person to stick up for the little guys; one person to create a revolution to right what is wrong. That is ALL she is doing.

      What you are doing is bullying her. And that is NOT right.

      Re-read her article, in it’s entirety WITH AN OPEN MIND! Sit back and really read it, chew on every word she says. It is VERY clear what her intentions were by writing this article and bringing to light the issue at hand: that there ARE bullies on the server in the form of big bands (and/or big band fans) that treat the little guys like garbage. And the bullies are showing their true colors both on Landroval AND in the comments of her article.

      Reply

      • Avatar of Lilikate Buggins.
        Lilikate Buggins. Says:

        I do not bully, I utterly regect the notion that I have bullied anybody.
        I think you are very far off the mark in your summation of my posts and intentions.

        I only tried to help. I only asked for a name. Shame on you for making this a bigger deal than it need to be.

        Reply

        • Avatar of Lilikate Buggins.
          Lilikate Buggins. Says:

          Here is a portion of Chastine’s origonal post that I have been enquiring about:
          Chastine- “One young man in particular poured his heart out to me, saying that he would really LIKE to join the Landy music scene, but that there are so many “big” groups that it’s simply too daunting and/or intimidating for him to get started. That makes me sad, guys!

          Nothing more :)

          Now I obey the Golden One, I apologise to anyone who feels offended or pressured. That was not my intention. Now I will await to see if I hear from any new bands needing assistance :)

          May we all be richer from this experience soon. I whole heartedly welcome any new talent that may arise from this post or organically in LOTRO on Landroval (or any server).

          Reply

  26. Cesela Says:

    I’ve sat back and watched/listened all week since Chastine’s article went live.

    I am Chastine’s RL sister. I play LOTRO as well. And I am a member of the Don’t Tempt Me Frodo kin/band. If it weren’t for her, I would know NOTHING of the music system and thus have no platform on which to stand and reply to this article and the subsequent rotten fruit throwing that is going on.

    I’m proud of her for speaking up on behalf of the little guys that want to play but are shunned when they announce they are playing at X time (which happens to be the same time as Y band). I’m proud of her for standing her ground and not letting this back and forth garbage get to her.

    LOTRO/Turbine gave ALL of us (yes, even the new little guys) an amazing music program to use in game. And I highly doubt they would be thrilled to hear that it’s being over-run and monopolized by but a few “Big” bands. I understand these big bands put in a lot of hard work to get where they are, I do. They have regularly scheduled concerts, at all the popular locations. That’s great. But, what’s not great is monopolizing those stages, and prime times for your concerts.

    In real life, big bands share the stage with the little guys. The little guys are the opening act for the big band. It’s how bands are discovered…and how bands make it.

    Landroval is the RP server, I get that. It’s where the serious people play. It’s where music became so popular (ie WeatherStock). It’s the place where the little guys want to get noticed, but often can’t because the market is over-saturated with love and blindness for the bigger bands. Why can’t…why HAVEN’T the big bands come up with the idea of posting an announcement in the LOTRO forums asking for up and coming bands to sign up to be an opening act for a bigger band? Why don’t the big bands announce IN GAME prior to their concert the same message…get a little band to “open” for them. This way, they get exposure on a public and popular stage.

    The suggestions I’ve read and the context in which I’ve taken them are that little bands need to give up and join a big band in order to be able to play music on Landroval. And that’s not right. Big bands would be offended if someone BIGGER came to them and said that. Be mindful of what you suggest and take into account how you would feel if someone suggested something you’re about to (or have) suggested.

    Most importantly, let’s all remember that this is a GAME. And as such, your celebrity status doesn’t carry over to real life. In reality, we are all just individual people brought together by our love of subject matter brought to life in game-form. Don’t let your in-game egos get the best of yourself OUT of the game.

    Besides, if it weren’t for LOTRO and the amazing music system they gave us, we would ALL be nobodies.

    *bows*

    Reply

  27. Avatar of Goldenstar
    Goldenstar Says:

    OK blog mom stepping in here warning everyone to knock it off with the “well you said this and you said that” and naming names.

    This stops or I will shut this down. Lets get back to the topic at hand of your thoughts, ideas, opinions of if newer bands need help or not.

    It’s ok to disagree, it’s not ok to be a fart face. *points forcefully and walks out*

    Reply

  28. Avatar of Harperella
  29. Fionah Fairskinne Says:

    Hullo there!

    *gulps*

    I’ve said this time and time again to people I’ve met on Landroval and other servers I play music on….

    “If it wasn’t for the more recognizable bands, my friend and I would not have created our own music band and followed in their footsteps”.

    I don’t play music as often as I’d like, due to real life commitments….BUT, when I’m strolling along Middle Earth, typically Bree and the Shire…and I hear a soloist or new band play music…..I get encouraged and I feel happy. I feel encouraged because in other servers I have been to, the streets are empty, lacking the vitality that in-game music offers. I feel happy hearing a new soloist or band play….because it’s my time to sit back and relax, and listen to someone else’s interpretation of a song. :)

    Having said that, yes….. I do think that new musicians deserve a spotlight somehow. But, as a budding musician…I am beginning to realize that maybe being appreciated for my music…isn’t related to the amount of people in the audience. I do admit…yes…..I wanted recognition ….both my music partner and I had created these songs…we wanted an audience. Yet…after several weeks of pursuing the spotlight…we realized that even if we played to ONE person, and that person had a positive experience, that was enough to make us happy. I remember playing music in my band, and there was only one hobbit there. Well, we kept playing…and he got inspired. We taught him how to play abc files….and off he went….happy as a clam. It was a real eye-opener for me, it was.

    Listen folks, fame…it only goes so far. You get your 15 minutes of fame…but in the end, it’s about your passion for the music, and your enjoyment of fellowship with others. I learned that through experience, and also wise counsel from a few good folks on Landroval who lead their own music bands.

    *steps off her podium and chuckles*

    And that’s enough of my preachin’…..

    Anyway, enough of my preaching.

    Reply

  30. Fionah Fairskinne Says:

    Ah, I have to also applaud Tromblon, Fincin, and Bredouille for inviting newer bands and/or soloists to their weekly Sunday concerts. And the Thursday ‘open mic’ concept in Michel Delving is brilliant as well.

    *claps her hands and smiles*

    Reply

  31. Fionah Fairskinne Says:

    In response to Chastine’s original post:

    She’s got some good points that I completely agree with.

    Here’s my feedback, as a new musician, and also speaking on behalf of my music partner.

    1) I felt like I had to jump around concert events, and make sure I wasn’t playing in my band if another well-known band was playing at the same time. My partner and I definitely felt like we were intruding on somebody else’s event.

    2) The many many bands out there and soloists….made us feel like we had to find some original songs that weren’t being played over and over again. Unfortunately, we discovered that others made the same song, but varied it slightly according to their taste. All that is fine, but…..it was hard to debut a song when almost everyone else had transposed and played it for the main music community. I think this may be indicative of the term ‘over-saturated’.

    3) We think there are two different types of audiences on Landroval. First, there is a core music audience made out of people who transpose of compose their own music. And second, there is an audience of people who don’t play ingame music, but are delighted to hear a song they’ve never heard before on Lotro. My band and I….we cater to the second group. We do not have the time to be scheduled in regular concert events, due to our fluctuating work schedules. And so, a solution for us was to just play whatever, whenever, and to whomever….depending on the days we logged in.

    This solution seems to work for us, and it is highly gratifying. We don’t feel the pressure to conform to someone else’s schedule. We play whenever we feel like. I have since turned off Regional Chat and the Events Channel, because I simply don’t want to feel like I’m stepping on someone’s toes by playing my band’s songs while another bigger band has a concert. The audience will choose who to listen to. If they choose to listen to a larger band….so be it. We will still play our music no matter what. If we get one person who listens….we still cheer. It doesn’t matter.

    Reply

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